I’ve just finished a book of Vajrasakhi’s called “The Brutality of Fact”, interviews with Francis Bacon about his art and life. The bit that I loved the most is where he talks of futility; But I do think that, if you can find a person totally without belief, but totally dedicated to futility, then you will find the more exciting person. It reminded me of Sangharakshita’s writing on ‘The Greater Mandala’ and of Aloka’s ‘Useless Manifesto’. There is something thrilling about the idea of being completely dedicated to nothing!
David Sylvester - At what age did you come to realise that death was going to come to you too?
Francis Bacon - I realised when I was 17. I remember it very, very clearly. I remember looking at a dog-shit on the pavement and I suddenly realised, there it is – this is what life is like. Strangely enough it tormented me for months, till I came to, as it were, accept that here you are, existing for a second, brushed off like flies on a wall.
I think of life as meaningless; but we give it meaning during our own existence. We create certain attitudes, which give it a meaning while we exist, though they in themselves are meaningless, really.
DS – a meaning in what sense?
FB - a way of existing day to day.
DS – a purpose?
FB – a purpose for nothing.
DS – so that in spite of the sense that life is ultimately futile, nevertheless one finds the energy to do something which one believes in.
FB – exactly. But believes in for nothing – but believes in. I know it is a contradiction in terms; it’s nevertheless how it is. Because we are born and we die, but in between we give this purposeless existence a meaning by our drives.
DS - you have, of course, a very positive distaste for all forms of religion – as much for what you call modern mysticism an for Christianity – so I don’t know how you feel about this, but for me the sort of shallow hedonism, the just wanting to have a good time, by which most people seem to live now, is a way to make life utterly boring.
FB - I absolutely agree with you. I think that most people who have religious beliefs, who have the fear of god, are much more interesting than people who just live a kind of hedonistic and drifting life. On the other hand, I can’t help admiring but despising them, living by a total falseness, which I think they are living by with their religious views. But, after all, the only thing that makes anybody interesting is their dedication, and when there was religion they could at least be dedicated to their religion, which was something. But I do think that, if you can find a person totally without belief, but totally dedicated to futility, then you will find the more exciting person.
